by Twilighter
I am going to make this really simple.
Below is a photograph I took on October 3rd, 2012 at 2272 S. Centilena Avenue in Santa Monica, CA , the scene where the Kristen Stewart Car Makeout Photos (FameFlyNet/US Magazine/PopSugar 55) were taken. Click the photo to fully open.
I have previously argued in Part 10 of the Grand Punk (available at this website) that virtually all of the Car Make Out photos contained a digitally altered element in the right sideview mirror of the Mini Cooper since that image was impossible to match up with the scene in question. Right side view mirror circled below. Click the photo to fully open.
Additionally, because of an astute observation by Badger, who has frequently commented on this blog, there is another digitally altered element, in that the reflection in the driver’s rearview mirror within the car has been grayed out, making it impossible to see who is in the car in the mirror’s reflection. Driver’s rear view mirror circled above.
And finally, due to anther discovery by Badger, a third digitally altered element is present in the PopSugar Photo #49 (now listed as PopSugar #51 on their website) in the reflection on the back window of the Mini Cooper. Rear window and reflection circled above.
Here is a blowup of that back rear section of the car. Click the photos to fully open.
Right Portion of PopSugar #49 (now #51)
Here is that image rotated 90 degrees clockwise.
Here is a blowup of that area.
Roof image magnified
What is shown in the photo is clearly a portion of the building roof tiles that have been photographed, flipped 90 degrees and photoshopped onto the reflection appearing in the back window of the Mini Cooper.
The source for element #3 was the roof tiles of the building
And it is absolutely impossible for that reflection in the back window to appear in that way naturally at the scene, since the building has been flipped 90 degrees to the right in the reflection. It was photoshopped in.
Furthermore, none of these alterations made the photos more salacious.
And all of these alterations were made to alert a careful viewer that these pictures were not what they seemed to be.
THESE ELEMENTS PROVE THAT THIS CHEATING SCANDAL WAS STAGED.
I will elaborate more fully on this in Part 13 of the Grand Punk. My Full argument as to element #1 is contained on this site at the Grand Punk Part 10 and more broadly through out the Grand Punk series.
For your reference here is Badger’s two emails to me regarding elements #2 and #3. My thanks and gratitude to Badger for assisting in helping to bust this cheating scandal wide open.
Badger, on February 15, 2013 at 12:38 am said:
The “brick wall” reflection in the car’s rear window in #49 looks to me exactly like the tiled roof of the Centenila Ave. building, only mysteriously turned sideways. Since the other reflections you point out have been turned in odd directions, maybe this one was made to appear vertical?
Badger commented on The Grand Punk Part 10
I haven’t seen anyone remark on the rear view mirror image. Not the side view mirrors, but the rectangular rear view mirror inside the car – visible in #4, #25, #45, #46, and #52.
In the pictures where it’s visible, the mirror reflects a blank grey surface – from where, I can’t tell. Shouldn’t it pick up some glimpses of the couple in the front seats? The mirror isn’t angled sharply to the right or left. It’s not angled upward, so it would reflect the car’s ceiling. It seems to reflect the seat back or head rest, but not the people occupying the front seat. Shouldn’t it at least pick up a glimpse of the top of Stewart’s or Sanders’ heads? It *appears* to reflect an empty car. Do you have any thoughts on the rear view?
Filed under: Uncategorized |
Justice For Kristen 
Congrats. Badger. I knew you would come up with some thing like this.
A small doubt about the rear view mirror. When you look at the subjects in the car they seem to be leaning too far away from the seats and to the front of the car. The back rests of the seats suggest that they are at least 12 or more inches away from their seats. In that case will their reflection appear in the mirror? Even though their heads look in a level with the mirror, I think physically they are well below it. We have also got to consider the position of the camera. Just a thought.
Valsan, I see what you mean about the angle of the mirror vis a vis the two people’s position, and it’s something I’m still not sure about. I *think* the rear view mirror should catch at least part of their heads, considering:
1. We have a 6’2″ tall man inside a Mini Cooper. How much space could there be between the top of his head and the car’s ceiling or ‘headliner’? (I don’t actually know, but I’m assuming it’s not a lot.)
2. There are several photos which show the interior mirror, and the subjects are in different positions in each, some further back than in the above picture, yet there is no glimpse of them in the mirror in any photo.
3. The mirror is not at an extreme angle, either to the right or left, where it might pick up a reflection of the side wall, or upward, where it could reflect the car’s headliner. You can tell by how much of the mirror glass is visible to the camera, which seems to be looking almost, but not quite, at a perpendicular angle through the driver’s side window. And if the mirror is not reflecting the ceiling, walls, or the people in the car, just what is it reflecting?
I still don’t know for sure. What we really need is somebody with access to a Mini Cooper, who can try to reproduce the photograph and see what appears in the rear view mirror.
I have already done some work with a Mini Cooper and undoubtedly because of the angle of the car to the photo, the position of the mirror, and what would be reflected within the car, I am virtually certain that a portion of the occupants would have been seen. It is clear that the reflection in that mirror was tampered with, most likely by simply graying out the whole image. Very easily done with photoshop because of the nature of mirror surround. I’ll elaborate in further editions, but that is the long and the short of it.
See my comment above to Badger. Even if they were entirely ducked down we don’t get a view of head rests, the right seat, the right window pillar, nothing. When we should have gotten something if the reflected image is actually a true image.
Thanks again. I got it. The problem is, I am wrestling with too many ideas. Like Badger said once it could be distracting.
Uh……o.k…….. speechless!!! For f*ck’s sake it screams that is staged why people don’t see it!?
Well, some one had to show us, you see? Which means we are not as smart as we thought. I am still thanking T57 & Badger.
Not to worry. There are dumber ones who still don’t want to see because they will then have to eat all the s@*# they threw at KS&RP.
LOL, There are dumber ones, now that’s funny. The first day I saw the pictrures and read the story, I thought no, she wouldn’t do that but then everyone said its true, but I didn’t want to believe, I saw them together from the beginning, deep down I just felt it was lie. I have been looking for the truth ever since, I found this place, signed up for twitter, found other places, but to be honest I still don’t understand why they did it?? Can someone tell me why they would try to pull off stunt like that and why would Rob, let Kristen take the fall? Another question is Rob and Kristen still together?
Beats the hell out of me!
You really want to check out the latest tweets of this girl @rainbowclimber (former csi robsten) about the scandal, what she thinks of you and the fans who believe the scandal is staged. If you can’t find her account just google csi robsten twitter.
Thanks. It was good of you to acknowledge your source, even if they were just comments on your own post.
You may not like me as well when I add that I was not saying the rear view mirror was necessarily greyed out. I was suggesting that EITHER it was greyed out to erase actual reflected images; OR the blank grey mirror is accurately reflecting what was really there, an empty front seat, and that the images of the couples were photoshopped in. Sorry to be such a skeptical wet blanket, but the empty mirror could be explained either way, and adding the people in the front seat has the more obvious purpose.
I will admit, though, that the reflected images of things which are actually there, but whose reflection has been positionally altered, such as the rear window reflection being turned sideways, makes the most sense according to your theory of staged photographs. In fact, it’s hard to explain using any other scenario.
I was wondering if that could be a reason also, no one in the car. It could be that whoever just forgot about the mirror, if no one was in the seat, or like you said colored grey so we could not see who was in the seat. So if it was staged with K knowing about it either with or without her cooperation why did it need to be colored grey? That doesnt make sense. If it wasnt K and they didnt want to do anything with the mirror coloring it grey would be easy thing to do.
If the mirror was blanked out, I suppose it would have to be taken in the context of all the other alterations made to the parking lot pictures: reflections turned sideways, in the wrong direction to the car’s position, etc. Twilighter’s theory, if I’m stating it correctly, is that these oddities were added deliberately when the pictures were staged. That could be done either because it makes a better prank if the pictures were full of obvious inconsistencies; or as a shout-out to the public of some kind; or possibly just to be funny.
As much as I like the “empty car” theory, Tw57 makes a good argument: the rear view mirror, seen from that camera angle, ought to show something, not just a blank surface.
Badger:
It not a matter of liking you or not liking you, it a matter of whether you are contributing thoughtful comments about the issues.
Which you certainly have. And now as to your specific comment.
I understand that you are not saying that they are necessarily blanked out but I am prepared to say just that.
What is seen in the mirror as you say is either what someone has added to it (grayed it out) or what was actually reflected as being there. This is why I am convinced it is the former rather than the latter: Close readers of the Grand Punk series will recall how in Part 10 I argued the position of the camera as being roughly at 55 inches from the ground because of our ability to see across the roof of the car. See Part 10 for those details, but suffice to say if it were significantly lower we would be unable to see the top of the roof and if it were significantly higher we would have been able to see much more down the inside door of the passenger side of the car. Thus the camera was approximately within the same plane as the rear view mirror. If it were remarkable higher it would reflect an image somewhat lower in the car. If it were remarkably lower it would reflect an image somewhat higher in the car. But because it is at roughly the same plane, the reflected image would be relatively comparable in terms of the plane of view as what the driver would see looking into the rearview mirror. Now as the angle of attack. The camera was obviously somewhat to the rear of Kristen’s door pillar. We know that because as we look at PopSugar #49 and most of the other pictures at the lot, the passenger door pillar appears to the right of the driver’s door pillar. Which means we are looking from an angle at the car from a position somewhat behind and to the left of the pillar. Because our view is at an angle which is less extreme (flatter) to the mirror than Kristen’s is, our reflected view would be more towards the passenger window and the passenger pillar side of the car than Kristen’s is (which presumptively is straight back into the car.) We know this because our angle of view is to Kristen’s left. Recall from physics, the angle of incidence=the angle of reflection. Thought about in those terms the right interior portion of the car including the seat and head rest and presumptively Rupert in it, the right passenger window area and beyond would be what would be in the reflected view. And yet nothing of the sort appears in the mirror. In fact, there is no scenario which would cause a plain gray view in that mirror. Even if the mirror were bizarrely angled upward, the view would not be like that given that the car has a sunroof. Since all we see is a plain gray image that cannot be explained by anything at the scene, the image was obviously added. I confirmed have this by examining comparable Mini Coopers and replicating the rough angles of view. It great having easy access to a Mini Cooper dealership.
That’s very clear and thorough. The angle from which the camera was viewing the mirror was exactly what was bothering me. Thanks!
Why was it staged and by whom?
So, they are fully aware of what they’re doing by using those elements. It’s obviously staged but since that no one said anything yet i don’t think it fits as the whole “Rob and Kristen taking their revenge from the media” thing. tbh I just don’t see how Rob and Kristen are players in this game anymore. And that’s what i don’t get. Who was behind it?
Lee: Your question is very simple. But the answer is not. If you start from the beginning of The Grand Punk part 1 and read through to part 12 it will be easier to understand it better. T57 has really made it look very simple. I would also suggest you go through the comments section in order to get the real hang of it. It was a revealation to me to know that there are still people who care about the well being of others.
I don’t know but i’m guessing Summit!!! As for mr Sanders….. well he showed us his real face!!!!!
That is the biggest question and mystery!
Badger, great work!! My question to T57 is while this is another great piece of the puzzle I dont understand why this as opposed to all the rest of the evidence is the smoking gun. To me the smoking gun would be a signed contract stating that R&K had to participate in this or a signed copy of a contract saying that summit hired FF, or someone to take the pics, or signed contract between summit and sanders, or finding all the pics taken that day or signed contract from the photo shopper and summit or whoever. So the who, and why still need answered.
In my opinion the car has to be laying on its side to have that particular element reflected in the rear window as shown in that photo. Where as the other elements may be 99% this one is a 100% fool proof evidence which can be produced in any court of law.
Wishing to see contracts of the types you described will be like asking for the moon.
Don’t you believe in clutching at a straw while you are drowning or say about to drown? Most of the evidences we have seen in TGP are better than any straw I have ever seen before.
BTW, I used to read all your replies to the haters on GC board which clearly indicated that you are a die hard supporter of these kids.
So am I. It looks as though we are more hurt and humiliated than they are. To a certain extend it could be true, I do not think they will ever waste their time reading all the crap and ensuing stupid comments these tabs produce. Their actions clearly say that they donot care about what any one says or believes about them. I personally believe that this scandal will not and cannot do any harm to their career or personal life. And believe me, 99% of all these so called haters will queue up to see her next movie when it comes out, if only to get another chance to criticise her.
We have our limitations, as supporters we can only hope and pray for their well being. In the mean time keep searching for further flaws in those photos like Badger did. Whether we can bring out the truth or not is another matter, at least we have another perspective which allowed us to see the other side of the story. By and by more people will get to know about it.
your right, I didnt look at it like that! duh, sometimes the brain goes! I basically quit going to GC or anywhere else, too irritating! The haters are too crazy really and getting more vocal and bold on twitter!I dont care about them any more, cant talk to an idiot! Thanks!
you are correct the car would have to be turned 90 degrees or the ground, take your choice, both are ridiculous.
If I understand the smoking gun metaphor, it fits here very well. A literal smoking gun is evidence that makes it obvious who did the shooting, but it would not be absolutely conclusive proof in a court of law; it would not provide information about motive; it would not tell us who hired the gunman. But it would be extremely strong evidence of what, basically, happened, that would be almost impossible to argue away.
So we have the smoking gun, but still have to go through the process of convicting the gunman.
I think these bizarre alterations to the photos are important because they couldn’t have happened by accident. They wouldn’t have been done to improve the pictures’ clarity, to make them more interesting, or more salacious; they neither hide nor more clearly identify the location; in short, these changes could not serve any purpose that paparazzi, photographers, gossip magazines or photoshoppers might have.
They could only exist in order to be what they are: deliberate oddities.
Thank you. You have succinctly stated what I think is the case in relation to these . I will elaborate more fully (as life has intervened and caused a short delay) but you are on the right path. They are deliberate and obviously do not advance any interests other than to telegraph to the observant that this whole thing is not what it appears to be. Now you have to add the rest of what we know to it. Not the BS, the stuff we know is provable.
I got that, someone the other day was talking about it, I wasn’t seeing it that way!! Sometimes the brain gets over heated!!! But I agree their is no war to explain these!!! Still am frustrated !!
Fair enough. It has been removed and now only bears a note that it was done at the request of the commenter.
@Misty__With all of the soundstages and private space available to Kristen and Sanders why choose to rehearse in so public a place? With her high public profile? Like a New Generation of the Rubix Cube
no matter which way you turn this puzzle it has a new possible answer but only one Truth.
Great catches by badger. I never noticed that before.
Wow…great job guys! So what now? There’s all of this proof but where does it take us? Will there be any kind of reveal or explanation? Or was this done, the obvious photoshopping, so that we would figure it out on our own? So the people who really support them will know it wasn’t real?
The thing is, at this point I don’t think a “reveal” or “ha, ha we punked you” would go over very well. Just curious what you all are thinking?
Thats what I mean, its beyond a funny point now. After a couple months before all the hate went viral it could have been Haha got ya, but not now. So Twilighter when you have all your evidence are you going to do something with it? 20/20 or 60 min or something. Book maybe, you could do do your own punk the media.
my thoughts exactly. we know now this whole thing was staged but now what?
btw T57, i wonder if the media or any tabs are aware of this blog?
Why don’t you place a similar car in the same position at the same place and go check the reflection on the window glass? Still it wouldn’t be accurate, because it depends on so many things. For instance: Where the photographer was, if he was standing, laying down on the ground, using a tripod, etc. A slight change of angle would cause a completely different reflection both in the driver’s rearview mirror, the sideview mirror and the rear window glass. Also, there’s something called image distortion, caused by the convexity of the window glass. So, this kind of speculation is a little pointless unless you have real experts studying them.
I think you need to read the complete series before you start making a bunch of suggestions that are unnecessary if you would bother to do so. And just for starters slight changes in the angles actually do not have much of an impact if you understand the physics of reflection. And I’m not sure what your point is. You complain that an actual reconstruction didn’t take, but then argue it wouldn’t matters because there are to many variables. Then you call for an expert. Tell you what, get back to when you make up your mind what you are really saying. Or go get your own expert if you don’t like what I have presented.
Twilighted57<<I agree too many people start having points of view before they've read all the information. On the other hand this subject is
intensely important to a lot of people who are amatuers. Some of these
grand funks I have read numerous times to make sure that I am getting the sense of them. Being a lawyer you were probabaly born with an analytical mind and Badger seems to be your truest equal. The rest of us are believing in Kristen despite some very bad pictures and playing catch up. I spent months
looking at the dam things and just saying I don't believe it and trusting in a person I never met becuse I like her and her behavior in this was so out of character. I kept thinking, " Not the Kristen I know." But then I don't know her. Only that she has never been wild or irresponsible, or made a misstep with her career in her life. AND that she appears totally besotted by Rob Pattinson. That was enough for me until I found you and veulent_savior on this sight. So please have a little more patience with us or ignore us. You have worked on this long and hard and are determined to lay your answers out as you think will best inform us, but
please sir, don't be so curt as you have been with Cate. Do you even know her age? I have a thirteen year old niece very devoted to this site.
Your Devoted Reader
Jean Worley
Point taken. However in Cate’s case there is little doubt that she was not thirteen years old. She was taking some positions that simply were not tenable at the time, laying back and telling others to do work that she should have been capable of, and suggesting actions that she then reversed herself on as being futile. At the time I was a bit irritated. I have no problem with people asking questions or even disagreeing as long as they have tried to give it some thought and are not acting as if they know something when they clearly don’t. My impression at the time was that she had not. But my apologies if I seemed curt at the time. As Bono once sang, “some days are better than others”.
Agree….
Well we got a problem with Suns too. Saying that Rob is calling Liberty. I don’t know what is going on here.
While I agree that the scandal was staged, I can’t say I support the conclusion about the back window reflection. You can replicate that type of reflection and, depending on the angles, the image is turned that way. Don’t get me wrong, I applaud the time and effort you have put into this and I hope the truth does come out one day. I would love to see the people responsible be held accountable. I think whoever did it greatly underestimated what the reactions would be.
Any particular reason you haven’t posted my comment above? Just wondering.
not sure what comment you are talking about
While I agree that the scandal was staged, I can’t say I support the conclusion about the back window reflection. You can replicate that type of reflection and, depending on the angles, the image is turned that way. Don’t get me wrong, I applaud the time and effort you have put into this and I hope the truth does come out one day. I would love to see the people responsible be held accountable. I think whoever did it greatly underestimated what the reactions would be.
Anne:
Sorry Anne, I think we found the missing comment.
But, paraphrasing a great line from Keira Knightley, I am disinclined to accept your assertion. 🙂 But I would be happy to entertain your explanation of just how that could be the case. And remember, the building has to be turned 90 degrees on it side.
Guys i was checking the comments of the latest R/K story on Gossip Gop and i’m trying to understand if they are written by adults o r8 years old kids!?
T57: Have you noticed a sparkle on the door handle in all the car make out photos (except #26 & #33). Wonder if it Is the sunlight catching on it or a flash. The shadow of the car in #26 tells me the sun is right overhead.
Even though the position of the car looks to be different (almost inside the 5th or 6th parking slot from the building) I can’t see how the sun can have that effect on that particular area of the handle. Help please.
just a quick look comment, the sun is not directly overhead, it is westerly if you take a look at the orientation of the site at Part 10. Another tip off is the sun’s direct reflection in PopSugar #37 in the chrome mirror. Now that one is difficult to place because of the extreme curvature of the mirror’s chrome, but basically when you put it all together the sun is relatively high but trending past noon and westerly is is shining across the car. Note how Kristen is lite within the car, the shadow of the car underneath the car, and how the light is coming somewhat to the car’s left but at a relatively high angle. The two glare points you identify in most of the photos seem conceivable. The reason they are not in 26/37 is because the car has been moved to or from a somewhat different position. #33 is in a totally different place on Stewart & Colorado.
Thanks, I had #37 in mind but wrote #33 instead.
Unless I’m mistaken, the sun coming from overhead but slightly to the west should be striking the passenger side of the car, or the front but slightly toward the passenger side, if the car is situated the way it seems to be in the photo. If the car were placed so that the parking space lines were actually parallel to the car as the reflection suggests, then the light hitting the driver’s side handle, and the sunlight directly on Stewart’s back and right shoulder through the driver’s side window, would make sense.
I think you have to start with the orientation of the lot first. If you run 2270 S. Centilena through Google, you will see that the lot’s north wall (left wall as you are looking into the lot from the street) runs in a northeast to southwest direction. At roughly the midpoint is where we see the dividing line in the wall, where it turns slightly more southerly whereas closer to the building it is running a little more westerly. Given that orientation, and the car being generally aligned to that wall, the sun strikes the driver’s side and potentially the front depending on how late in the day it is. Given the lack of shadows penetrating very far into the car, or the car itself not casting much of a shadow, is what tells us that it is not late in the day.
Is it possible that the photos were taken at a different location and then photo shopped on to the parking lot. When you look at the photos you can see white finger prints on the door and window except in #26 and #37. #26 and #37 shows the car parked in a different way. A some what clean car and a dirty car at the same location at the same time confuses me. I remember discussing this issue before. Then we were thinking that the photos may have been taken on different days. Does it also mean to say that on the day they were in the clean car nothing happened. The following day (or any other day) they went to the g/rail, took the photos and came back to the parking lot with the dirty car for the next session?
Ok……….. some of the so called Kristen fans(i’m talking about the ones who believe she actually cheated but forgave her when Rob did) are just completely and utterly pathetic!!! She doesn’t share personal moments with her boyfriend but yeah she makes out with her “lover” in public!!! Get real hypocrites!!!!!!! You have been manipulated by the media!!!!!!
These “fans” are the real problem. They have accepted the sham and keep the shit storm against Kristen going. I find it funny how we are attacked for pointing out that this scandal was staged and defending Kristen’s character, these “fans” say, “she did it, apologized, now stop bringing it up…it was 7 months ago, drop it, etc., etc..”, yet they allow the vile haters to continue on with their hate campaign against Kristen. The haters, some of them anyway, are paid plants put on websites to keep the arguments going! These “fans” don’t realize that they are being used; they are feeding the tabs the headlines with their scenarios and worries about R and K’s status. They are fools and yes, hypocrites.
My first thought was that she was set up. That Rupert came on to her knowing photo’s were being taken….etc. About a month ago someone referred me to this sight. Everything fit what my gut was saying. This site is awesome. No more haters!
I have to say that if she had made a mistake, I still would have defended her. No one deserves what has been done to her! I defended her not knowing what I know now because I thought it was the right thing to do! I never believed what the tabloids said or the haters. Just to make that clear!
What does this means? I hope its not over for them two. I mean Rob and Kristen. Does this mean that she have been set up. Or what? I really don’t get it.
t57 : the evidences you presented are sufficient to make a conclusion that the scandal was ” staged” or untrue. Can i suggest that you present this to the mainstream media or journalist. i believe that this is significant because it reflects the problem of bullying which is happening to our society today.
That time will come. It may be a matter of trying find whether a journalist or the mainline media still exists. But I am an optimist by nature. Thanks for the suggestion.
in pop sugar pics #2,6,7,11,24,31,45,46,47,49 if you look in the left corner of the passenger door window there looks to be a face and a bright dot. It is not noticed in #15,18,27,36,39, either because K’s head is there or its not seen. Its either a reflection or for some reason the dust on the window changes
so do you not agree?
??
Nena: All is see on the left corner of the window is what seems to be a handprint in the same white substance that covers the driver’s side door and window.
One shouldn’t be harsh on them. Some times the brain blacks out when one sees such photos. When they get to know about this site they will also come around to our way of thinking. It is the haters that are causing the problems – not to KS & RP – but to people like us.Dogs bark but the elephants walk on.
In my opinion the true fans are the ones who will support her even if she did cheat for real. To err is human.
[quote]”In my opinion the true fans are the ones who will support her even if she did cheat for real. To err is human.”[/quote]
True. No matter how questionable the photographs and accompanying story seem to be, whether or not there’s any truth behind them is NOT the only issue.The reason this first attracted my attention, back when I assumed the report was accurate, was because of the vicious and demeaning way Stewart was treated by the press.
Even if the pictures were all accurate and unaltered, all they would show is Stewart hugging and kissing her married director, fully dressed, in broad daylight, in a public place. And we would still not know the context in which any of this occurred. It certainly wouldn’t warrant the kind of brutal shaming Stewart has been subjected to.
I don’t know what’s behind the hostility Kristen Stewart seems to inspire; but those of us who want to defend her have to avoid the idea that we can only do so if she is shown to be “pure” and to have never committed any actual indiscretion.
Is there another building on the other side of the parking lot because on the car it shows another building
Not sure how to interpret you question but if you go to Part 10 there is an aerial image of the entire area that shows the lots and buildings in relation to each other.
Now I think I get your question. There is a building to the right over the wall but it is well over and the wall is tall enough to block it even when you are in the position of the mini. So, yes the door reflection shows a building that isn’t there. Go to Part 10 for a more detailed discussion
For what it’s worth, I think one of the reflected buildings can be identified. If you look at the reflection in the side of the car, on our far left you can see an area where the white wall seems to curve. There are two little flags sticking out the top of that wall. You can see them just to the left of the driver’s door hinge.
Now, if you look at a Google image of the area or at one of your site photos, you’ll see a building near this parking lot, with a row of small flags placed all along the edge of the building’s wall, the edge facing and running parallel to Centinela Avenue. In the parking lot photo, the building would be to our right. The proportions of the flags to the wall are the same; I’m very sure this is a reflection of that building. Whether or not it should logically be reflected this way when the car is parked there, I’m not sure. I think the car’s side panel would reflect the building if it were parked along the left wall as it seems to be, but then we’re still left with the reflected parking space lines running in the wrong direction.
The building adjacent to the right is LA Wine and Art storage. There are a series of flagpoles that run along the top of it that can be seen within the parking lot if you are at the right spot. Problem is that from within the lot, you can’t see the building, only the flag poles. And the door reflection appears to be showing a building, almost as within the lot, (look from the middle of Kristen’s door to her rear tire), which isn’t there. And as you note, the parking lines are still screwed up.
Twilighter: I understand about the building not being visible from inside the parking lot. However, the building with the flags, combined with the reflection of the adjacent billboard, seems exactly as the reflection might appear if the car were parked in the parking lot next door, the next one to our right if we’re looking at the photograph above.
The billboard with the single supporting post, if reflected in a car parked in the lot beneath it, would appear just the way it does: as a “7” shaped shadow in the upper part of the door panel. Combined with the wall holding the flags, it SEEMS to place the car in the parking lot just left of LA Wine & Art Storage.
Of course, the remaining reflections don’t match that location. If your premise is that they were screwing around with the reflections, why not add one that could only occur in a different but nearby location? Unless, of course, some of the photos were taken in the adjacent lot, and the reflections mixed.
Hi t57, I have another tbeory about the why in this case I’d like to get feedback on. On imdb.com the only projects Rupert has listed are all written by him and have ??? next to all their names. Could rob and Kristen have staged this to ruin Rupert? While filming swath Kristen injured her wrist and her ankle bad enough to stop filming for a week. She also recieved multiple cuts and bruses. Multiple cast members tweeted that Kristen called rob every time she was injured and wouldn’t get treated until he got to the set. Rob was the one who took her to the hospital when she hurt her foot. They also said rob was very concerned and started spending more time on the set. Directors are supposed to watch out for their stars not let them get injured. Rupert’s reputation is ruined. Fans hate him and it seems that nobody is in the market to hire him. Do you think this could be a viable explanation?
Don’t think so, not buying it. There would be plenty of other ways to express such displeasure without going through this. Also the unpinnings of her being continuously injured throughout the shooting is not supported by the factual record.
Just wanted to throw it out there. I’d rather believe that then what is probably the truth. Privacy and image. I don’t know if I believe the whole punk the media anymore. Seems more likely they staged it for their own reasons. If that’s the case then we won’t ever get the truth. We may just have to move on without answers unfortunately.
ok you say that doing this to ruin Rup’s reputation could have been done other ways to express their displeasure with out going through this. Well why do you think that going through this just to change their images and needing fans to not associate them with twilight so they would see them as individual actors and no longer Edward and Bella could not have been accomplished any other way? I mean every other movie they have done inbetween each of the Twilight movies were not teen movies. They were very adult movies. I just think doing this to get out of Twilights shadow is overkill!!!! You really dont think that if they just moved on to movies they wanted to make which most young teens couldnt see that things wouldnt have come to an end? A natural end? No tent city for their new movies, hopefully parents wouldnt let teens go to the premieres, it just could have gone away. Now things are so bad, 100x worse than before scandal. Is this what you think R&K wanted? Not trying to be mean here but it just seems way to crazy to have done this just to move on. I have a 17 and 19 yo daughters and would just have moved on, seen THG, or other movies for their age group. I just think IF it was their idea it was a real bad one, and someone on their team should have been smarter.
I am not saying that the punk’s only motivation was to fans to let go of them as Bella and Edward. Quite the contrary, I think it was only an ancillary benefit. And they certainly could have accomplished that by continuing to take roles inconsistent with those personas as they already had been doing. But this whole thing was about a lot more than that and its end result provided them with a perfectly plausible explanation of why they fell off the face of the planet for over twenty days in Rob’s case, from July 22nd to August 12th, and nearly forty seven days in Kristen’s case, from July 22nd to September 5th. Completely out of the public eye. During that time nearly everyone assumed that they were separately trying to recover from the effects of Kristen’s indiscretion. And stories swirled about dog custody fights, moving vans, and refusals to communicate. Which we should have immediately known was just as faked and staged as the “cheating pictures” themselves. But if that indiscretion never occurred and was staged as I have taken great pains to point out throughout this series, what were they doing during that period and why did they need a plausible explanation for their absence? Solve the details of that question and you have solved the entire mystery.
That is the million dollar question! Have you solved it??
Solving it is sometimes the easier half of the problem. Its proving it that can be the more vexing.
Marriage? This was thought from the beginning. But its so out of hand and spun in a bad way! But why not end this now? All it has accomplished is more vile hate towards K, R is seen as a weak wimpy guy, fangirls are more crazy than ever, haters are more vile and crazy than ever before, paparazzi are more vile and crazy than before, tabloids are more vile and crazy than ever before, people know the wifes name now and his name, K’s friends are being insulted and stocked now, her mother is being misquoted now, leading people to believe she wanted K to cheat, its been 8 months and tabs still continue to make up stories, more actors are getting on the hate/bash the KS hate train people in her own business. Time to end this! Now people are going on podcasts and spouting crap, lies they are stating as fact and using their position to have people believe what they are saying.
I don’t know, but I have heard many rumors that he was not nice at times and very rough with K. Also many people mention a video of Rup very roughly putting K in a car!!
Rumors and mentions don’t count as provable evidence. If we slip into believing them anything goes in terms of the truth. And that is a very dangerous world to live in.
Aside from that supposed apology from Kristen, her reactions have been much like an ancient queen of old, secure in her own knowledge of herself, she refuses to rise to criticism of her actions. Having full knowledge of how jealous people are of her; and that no defense even
to the fabricators admitting what they did would change things.
I think people need to believe bad of her so they can continue coveting
Rob without feeling bad about themselves. If they admitted to themselves that she was a good hard working girl and all of their criticism had not been justified they’d have to see themselves for what they are: bitter, jealous women who Rob will never see. Because Kisten
is all he sees.
Hello twilighter, just thought i’d mention that if you look just under the left tail light you’ll find another reflection. Look closely and you’ll see what looks to me like the reflection of the white building with the burgundy stripe which if memory serves me correctly should be to the right of the parking lot. This buildings reflection is also flipped 90 degrees.
Wouldn’t be surprised. I will take a look.
Talking about reflections on the car door, can any body explain why the parking slot borders are not reflected on the door in PS #26 when the right hand side (as you enter) wall is completely reflected in it. I can only see two white lines. If I am not mistaken the car is parked a lot coser to the building and facing the entrance.
I think Twilighter dealt with this in Part 10. All the reflections show something from the parking lot, but they’re all out of place, and each suggest something different. The left side wall can be seen beyond the car, on the passenger side, and the office building to the rear of the car. Assuming that’s how the car is placed, the reflected wall and parking space lines are running in the wrong direction; so are the reflection of the telephone wires and the image in the chrome of the driver’s side mirror. The reflection in the passenger side mirror shows the building nearby, but it’s…I’m not sure – sideways? upside down? Not as it should appear, at any rate. And the rear window reflection of the roof of the building, as we see in this post, is rotated to the side. So who knows why the borders aren’t reflected? Nothing is where it belongs.
Badger has given a good summary but the details are in Part 10. My original focus was on the sideview mirror because it so obviously cannot be matched to the scene, period. Ditto the wires and the lefty side wall reflection. They are present but scrambled in the image in a way that makes them impossible. But Badger subsequently pointed out the problems with both the rear view mirror and the rear deck window reflection. I summarized her evidence and expanded upon it to a degree in the The Smoking Gun. And while your at it you’ll see the same problems in the door reflection at Colorado Ave. & Stewart Street at Summit. Also covered in part 10.
Patience, Christopher.
Patience is a card game I never was any good at. How about you? My email is down.
Velma Jean Holmes put it altogether and has gotten the word out on one sight. If I were her I’d spread it as far as it will be accepted.
I m not sure what Twilighter was hoping to do. Wereyou?
@DAWN Ithink CD is referring to February 28th’s Do I Dazzle You?
VJH posits a very interesting provable by facts theory about the movers and shakers of Hollywood power. Is this proof? Probably. Does it serve
Rob and Kristen to say it? Probabaly not. I notice she did not post it on any other site. Probabaly because she came to the same conclusion. Just because it’s the truth doesn’t mean it should be shouted from the roof tops unless you own or control all of those roof tops.
She I think only posts on her blog site I think. Did you see all the HW jokes after the Oscars? Even the Pope joke about The Pope forgetting to thank HW in his acceptance speech? Even writers posted things on twitter about HW being owned by HW, funny notice the initials!!
Who benefits the most from this? Liberty Ross ! Jealous of kristen. Rupert was cheating on her with other women (not Kristen). Got all she wanted in quick divorce.
People keep acting like Liberty needed some excuse to get a divorce. Wake up people. California like most other states now is a no-fault divorce state. That means all they have to do is allege irreconcilable differences and that is it. That’s pretty much all it takes. She didn’t need to set him up to get a divorce. Now property distribution is another matter. But forget this idea that you need “grounds” to dissolve a marriage. That was pre 1970’s.
Sometimes t57, I think you and I may be the only ones who will ever understand the truth. Rob and Kristen are changing their images and a big part of doing that was staging the scandal. They needed to get fans to disassociate them with twilight as quickly as possible so they would see them as individual actors and no longer Edward and Bella. Rob’s role in the rover is not a sex symbol. Neither are his upcoming roles in mission blacklist or Lawrence of Arabia. first they give away their surfboards at the teen choice awards now the MTV movie awards tragedy. I do think they’re both as sweet and shy as we’ve always thought. They are desperate to get out of twilight’s shadow. I can understand that. After all the paps won’t go away until we fans do.
Add on to my comment. Yes I do think the scandal was also staged to take down gossip sites too as I’ve said before. Their post twilight images play a part in it too. Even though I do understand why they would do this, it hurts very badly to see what it’s done to this amazing fandom and worst of all the twilight saga has been screwed out of the heart felt farewell it rightfully deserved. There is a crack in this mommy’s heart that will never heal because of that. Do you think rob and Kristen maybe regret what they did a little bit? I really would like to know how they feel about what happened with the MTV movie awards. What are your thoughts about the MTV movie awards t57 if you don’t mind me asking.
I think Bill Condon’s comment in an interview with Entertainment Weekly in August is quite appropos.
“The fact is, these are actors playing parts, and maybe it’s not such a bad thing that people be reminded of that,” the director said. “Both of these actors gave heart and soul to the ‘Twilight’ movies, not only during shooting, but also by navigating so graciously the whole life-in-a-fishbowl aspect of the phenomenon. Above all they have always shown great respect for the fans who made these movies such a success. Now it’s time that some of that respect be returned to them.”
The fact is Rob & Kristen gave everything they had to this franchise including five years of their lives and their privacy. And they continued to give throughout the process of promoting the final release. What more could be expected of them Keeping the fans happy by displaying their relationship like it was produced for the fan’s entertainment? The fans got everything they deserved in terms of the film. What were they screwed out of? And when is enough enough? Like Bill said its time that some of that respect be returned to them
Tw57, I could not agree more.
I think Bills comment could be a dig towards Summit! Nothing was mentioned by him of fans respecting them and it could mean that its the suits at Summit that have been using them for money and using every aspect of their lives for money should return some respect. I think summit is the one who wanted to use a relationship between the stars! If summit hadn’t have pushed it and just have let things be who know where things would be right now! Summit pushed and created this media storm. Who knows, fans may have given up the they are a couple stuff. Yes there are crazy fans but I think they have become more insane since July, I mean really we have no idea how things would be if 1. Summit had never interfered and 2. If the fake scandal would never have happened!
I respectfully disagree.
“The fact is, these are actors playing parts, and maybe it’s not such a bad thing that people be reminded of that,” the director said. “Both of these actors gave heart and soul to the ‘Twilight’ movies, not only during shooting, but also by navigating so graciously the whole life-in-a-fishbowl aspect of the phenomenon. Above all they have always shown great respect for the fans who made these movies such a success. Now it’s time that some of that respect be returned to them.”
That last sentence and the opening setup sure seems like it is aimed squarely at the fandom.
If you want to see who benefitted the most read the last half of February
28th’s DO I DAZZLE YOU.
Not even close. I refer you to FEB.28 Do I Dazzle You. Why Ms. Holmes posted it there is anyone’s guess.
Liberty wanted revenge on Rupert & her dislike for Kristen was the reason for the scandal. Liberty managed to try & hurt Kristen but failed. Liberty shot down Rupert’s career in the filming business. Good revenge. Kristen has not been hurt by Liberty’s malice. She is a star & money maker for the filming industry. Liberty needed to get reconized because she is a nobody.
There is only one of the links that proves my words http://www.thehollywoodgossip.com/2012/07/charlize-theron-so-mad-at-kristen-stewart/
Your citing a gossip rag”s (hollywoodgosip.com) regurgitation of another gossip rag (Radaronline) which is using an unidentifed insider to prove something about how Charlize Theron alleged feels? Knock it off. We have had endless discussions about this kind of nonsense on this website and trying to prove something with this kind of tripe is a quick way to get your comments banned. Don’t waste our time. Consider yourself warned.
Stage? No…I do not believe that Kristen would do something that ‘cheap’…This would mean that she doesn’t care about her fans…and that she actually fooled them…I believe she respect us all…
Now the fact that she cheated is only her own personal problem..Not ours..We are her fans because of her ‘works’ not her personal life!
I don’t think there is anything automatically inconsistent with the notion of this being staged and the idea that she respects her fans. And if fans stay focused on her work, who cares what she does in her personal life, including staging an indiscretion.
Simplest of remedies, unfortunately the hardest to practice, hence this chaos. Life could have been a lot easier for the fans only if…..
Staged or not……That made both Charlize Theron and Chris Hemsworth to dislike Kristen…
According to whom or what. I don’t think either of them have said a single thing about it. So what is your comment based on? Another tabloid account?
There were several tabloid stories claiming Charlize Theron was angry with Kristen Stewart, but they had all the earmarks of the usual made up nonsense.
There is actually. I do not care about her personal life, but I wouldn’t like to know that she fooled me or other fans. Just let her cheat, let her do mistakes. She is human after all. We all do mistakes. Nothing is stage.
As they say, ignorance is bliss.
Not to me.
Actually..They both said it..Charlize said it clearly…and Chris through an interview he gave lately, when the interviewer asked him about Kristen. Anyway. Don’t get mad. I am not hater and don’t want to be aggressive or something. I’m just saying that no matter if the whole thing was staged…It stigmitized her..and it’s bad…
Don’t talk conclusions. If you have a link to an interview that proves what you say, provide it, and people can come to their own conclusions based on it.
As I said is ONE prove. And wait a mintue, I was not aggressive to you or rude to you for something. I don’t get why the whole ‘warning’. I can’t have an opinion?
You are free to have any opinion you want. But don’t assert that you have something of value to offer on this website about something in issue if it turns out to be based on tabloid BS. At the very least, you should have advised in advance that you are citing a tabloid’s unnamed source. But you didn’t disclose it until we forced it out of you. And you acted as if you were stating a provable fact. Not in keeping with the level of discussion we try to have here.
She had so many young girls looking up to her whether she wanted them to or not. Her and rob both consistently pointed out that they’re not fake. That’s why most fans have such a hard time believing they would stage the scandal. Making their fans believe a lie would me they are fake. What they did was immature and wrong even if I do understand why they would do it. They should have let the saga end drama free instead of trying to force it to end quicker for the sake of their post twilight careers. It’s never right under any circumstances to hurt people for one’s own benefit. They are/were so beloved that nobody ever dreamed Kristen would ever cheat or they would ever stage this. Their fans mostly young girls thought they were perfect so something like this happening deeply impacted them. It’s hard to describe unless you’re a fan. Whether they believe she cheated or it was staged, the hurt ran deep. No I don’t think they.care about their fans anymore. They wouldn’t have done this if they did. I’m not ranting or screaming. I just want to try to help you understand what they did to all of their fans. Us older fans do umderstand they want a life without twilight but hearing these young girls hurt on twitter or Facebook is heartbreaking for us. Just an fyi, you’ll never be able to convince any of their fans that them staging this was okay for them to do. They meant the world to their fans. This whole mess is just wrong. You just don’t do something like this to people that look up to you. I honestly feel instead of staging this to get rid of twilight, they should have just left Hollywood. Just my opinion. Would have saved a lot of young girls lots of heartache. Thanks again t57 for all your hard work. You’ve got one bumpy road ahead of you. Good luck.
In all due deference, fans regardless of their age, do this to themselves. Particularly in an instance when the actors involved had no desire to be placed on a pedestal not of their own making. Why should Rob and Kristen have to cease working in a profession they enjoy and are good at? Just because others are unwilling or unable to separate fantasy and reality and leave them to their own personal lives. And its never right to heap abuse on someone you idolize just because they fail to live to your self imposed standards on them.
It may seem harsh, but I believe that its true: if fans feel a heart ache over this, despite the fact that Rob and Kristen are only actors in a role as Bill Condon rightfully pointed out, it is they who need to reexamine their lives, and try to figure out what drives them to feel that way and why they can’t deal appropriately with the fantasy that is Hollywood. And that doesn’t matter what celebrity is being subjected to such grief.
Dawn and T57: “Her and rob both consistently pointed out that they’re not fake. That’s why most fans have such a hard time believing they would stage the scandal. Making their fans believe a lie would me they are fake. What they did was immature and wrong even if I do understand why they would do it. They should have let the saga end drama free instead of trying to force it to end quicker for the sake of their post twilight careers. It’s never right under any circumstances to hurt people for one’s own benefit. They are/were so beloved that nobody ever dreamed Kristen would ever cheat or they would ever stage this.” I agree 100% with this part of what you said. I think that all of this was unnecessary! Even if it comes out that they indeed do this, It will always be wrong because I dont feel it was needed or smart. But like T57 said if the fan girls cant separate fantasy from reality its not R&K”s fault BUT saying that this is something about some teens this age. BUT I still put the blame of Summit for wanting to turn their relationship into money. So if teens cant separate fantasy from reality it is Summits fault!!!! So if R&K want to be mad be mad at them, not the fans as the hate is misdirected. R&K should not be on a pedestal or an idol, but again that was the studio. But this is just so dumb to even think of anyone doing this. I just dont think deceit on any level like this is needed. T57 Why dont you think things would have just faded into the sunset? No one would have been hurt and life would have gone on. Now it cant and wont ever.
Maybe so or maybe not. Lets see how it plays out. But the fans were going crazy long before Summit even realized what they had. Remember at the first MTV video awards appearance by Rob and Kristen and at the first ComicCon. They were all blown away, Summit included. Fandamonium was already rampant and quite frankly out of control. I am not saying Summit didn’t eventually try to take advantage of it. But I think its a pretty hard sell that they created it. if anything they were way behind the curve and didn’t realize what they had.
Just another perspective here. Suppose some obviously doctored photos are offered to the tabloids from a suspicious source with an unconvincing story about how he got them. The tabloids publish them anyway, present them as authentic, and turn the story into the scandal of the century. Who is to blame? Who is being “fake?”
If the whole thing was staged, it may have been staged in order to follow what the gossip press did with it thereafter – presumably so it could be revealed at a later date. Whatever the intention, if the press had behaved like responsible journalists, we’d have no scandal, and no disappointment for the fans.
My fear is the days of responsible journalism are over. Paddy Chayefsky tried to warn us of the dangers of corporate tv news in his brilliant screenplay for Network nearly forty years ago. It has been all downhill ever since.
I agree. But I still think that could have been accomplished in a few months not 8. Why have your family,friends and yourself go through this for this long??? It is crazy, what if some crazed R fan would have tried to hurt her?
As far being fake I was only talking about if R&K staged this. I agree about media being amoral!! And If just one level had questioned this it would not have happened!!
I meant to say, what if they had staged the pictures and then arranged for them to be delivered to the tabloids or to FFN as if coming from a free lance photographer. Stewart and anyone else working with her would be guilty of faking the scandal, but as you say, it wouldn’t have gone anywhere if anyone along the way had dealt with the pictures and story honestly. It’s kind of like an undercover police officer trying to buy illegal items. He’s “faking” but the fakery only works on someone who’s truly dishonest.
Yes true, but I still don’t agree with them in on it willingly! If they planned the pics and story that would in my book make them fake, playing the HW game! I just have a hard time with deceit especially on this grand a level for most reasons, and the only one that would serve a purpose (punk media) has missed it’s reveal time. I wrote more on the GP 10 yest
I see Twilighter replied to the question of their being forced to fake a scandal by their studio. I have to agree, the law would not allow for that kind of coercion, and I find it unlikely everyone involved would agree to keep quiet about it. What kind of massive blackmail scheme would have to be behind it to force the silence of all these unrelated people?
Where you and I disagree is on seeing a deliberately staged scandal as “fake” and “playing the Hollywood game.” I see it as kind of anti-Hollywood. Assuming they actually did as Twilighter suggests, it’s not the usual approach of either ignoring the tabloids, suing them, or letting your publicist issue more favourable material to balance out the lies – all of which has done nothing in the past to change the way gossip is manufactured. Instead, they decided to be proactive and creative, and beat the tabloids at their own game.
I compared it earlier to a cop pretending to be a drug buyer in order to catch dealers. Yes, he’s being dishonest in a literal way, but that shouldn’t offend the majority of law-abiding citizens who want drug dealers off their streets. Following what happens to a fake gossip story from its inception is one way to completely uncover how the gossip industry works. Why should we be offended when we’re told, “look, everything these publications is saying about us is fake, and here’s proof.” Wouldn’t we want to know about the fakery?
It’s not dishonest to elicit lies, even by an outward show of deceit, for the sake of an exposé. If this isn’t what Stewart et al have done, I hope another celebrity does do it in the near future!
I agree that the long delay argues against the whole idea, although I’m waiting for Tw’s take on that.
This is what I have argued all along in scenario 6, that there never was any paparazzi taking pictures, only someone who posed as such at R & K’s behest (a fake free lancer) who passed off the photos (and probably the fake description of how they were taken) as well. Such would completely explain why US Mag and FFN were so clueless as to the actual location where they were taken. Circumstantially, I would say that this transfer probably occurred on or about July 17. Because immediately thereafter on the 18th FFN is out there chasing Kristen all over town looking to photograph her, which is why we get the gym pictures. They were looking for confirmation and maybe more dirt.
That is also why we get the odd notations on the after-the-fact pictures of the locations that were taken and displayed on the FFN website. If they were passed by a fake free lancer, how would FFN even know how to find the actual locations if the free lancer didn’t tell them? They wouldn’t. Problem is in their rush to sell and print the pictures, they didn’t actually go to the locations that were given until well after and they realized that something was hookey about the story. That why their general view stock photos of the locations are from several days later and we get this indication on the photos “that images of the two of them together at these locations have just surfaced a couple days ago.” If FFN had actually taken them they wouldn’t have indicated that the photos “surfaced”, they would have said that the photos were taken by them.
But that underlies the reality of what tabloid “journalism” is. Its about making the money as fast as you can with the only check being trying to avoid getting your ass sued off in the process. And just as you describe the fakery only works on someone who is themselves truly dishonest.
“That is also why we get the odd notations on the after-the-fact pictures of the locations that were taken and displayed on the FFN website” What was said, and did FFN actually go to the real places and take pics and put just site pics on their site? I agree that FFN did not get the scoop to get the pics and never believed the stupid story. I dont understand what you mean here? I never knew or went to the FFN website. Or “That why their general view stock photos of the locations are from several days later and we get this indication on the photos “that images of the two of them together at these locations have just surfaced a couple days ago.”” was this on their site? Im just confused by what they put on web site, not arguing here. I just have no idea what was on their site, I thought alot of their site you need creds to view it so I never even looked. BUT while I agree with all of this and I know it seems that I am always arguing but why cant everything you said above be true but take out the R&K”s behest and put in Summit?? Everything I agree with, all your evidence but I still think that all your evidence can also point to R&K having no choice in the matter, no planning of it, just had to go along with it?
As I mentioned long ago, you can go to the FFN website, and if you are willing to pay to access the site, those are the pictures you will see. Not the “scandal” pictures just the GV’s with the notations I described. S. Centinela and Pacific View Drive photos. I refused to pay out of principle but I know someone who has, which is why I have seen them.
Here are a couple problems with your Summit forced them scenario: 1. Let’s just say for the sake of argument that Kristen was forced. How did Summit “force” Rupert to participate. He is not contractually bound to Summit, he was the director on a Universal film, completely different company. 2. The notion that Summit can contractually “force” Kristen to do anything in the name of promoting a film is preposterous: her lawyer wouldn’t negotiate such a contract, a court wouldn’t enforce such a contract, and such a contract would likely violate the Screen Actors Guild Contract between film makers and actors regardless. People have this archaic notion from the forties that the studios are completely in control. That is not the reality anymore.
the only way is if in the contract it says they must do promo and PR for the movie, which Im sure is in there about that. So say Summit says you signed this and this is what we consider necessary for PR for the movie, we want it to seem that you two break up like in NM and then get back together before the promos to get more people to want to go to tent city and the promos to see how you two react to each other and go to the movie. Im not saying that the way they acted at the promo was fake< I dont think they ever broke up and they acted like a couple in love, that had never suffered a break up at all. That is maybe why the need for photo shopping some of the pics because maybe K would not cooperate. Summit made aware of the need. And maybe who ever took the pics if a freelance person was paid off by K and team to photo shop many of them so badly to give clues they are fake. As far as Rupert who knows what was promised to go along. His marriage was over and so he thought what the hell, if the price was right. I mean why do you think he did it for R&K? Or maybe K said since I have no choice, can we use Rup, I know his marriage is over so he may be game. I admit I have limited knowledge of HW but from what I have heard and seen nothing is off limits, and that studios use actors all the time for their own gain, have them fake little relationships for short times right before promos. We talked earlier about summit causing alot of the fan hysteria, well Im sure summit didnt really care about what any of this was doing to R&K, if they did care the tent city and all that would not have happened. Summit was responsible for all that, so in my opinion they new and did not care about R&K only how much $$$$ they were making. Tent city just fed on the hysteria. I really do appreciate all your hard work!!!!!
You are missing the point. I’m a lawyer remember? These contracts are quite specific as to what promotional events need to be attended, how much they are paid, how travel costs are covered, what hours they must commit, under what circumstances they are able to avoid attending an event, etc, etc, etc. Otherwise, actors would be at the mercy of whatever the film producers want. They don’t simply agree to do “promotion” leaving it to be determined later what that promotion means. And any attempt to dictate what was going on in their private lives would be met with resistance by her legal team. Especially from a couple who eschews such outside interference. And if Kristen didn’t want to “cooperate” she could have easily said “screw you” and her lawyers would have been in an excellent legal position to say the same. The Thirteenth Amendment to the Constitution eliminated slavery in this country. She couldn’t have been forced to do something she wanted didn’t want to do and wasn’t contractually required to do. As I said earlier, such a clause would be unenforceable at law. And if they tried to sue her on such a contract, she would have smoked them, let alone Summit would have had a different PR problem on their hands.
Now if she wanted to do this, that’s another matter. And perhaps maybe even Summit encouraged her to do this because they thought it was a good marketing plan. But people have to give up this notion that Big Bad Summit forced her into doing something that she didn’t want to do. They are clinging to this notion because they don’t want to believe that Kristen would be involved in something that not only fooled the tabloids but also worked to fool her fans. But that is exactly what the evidence tends to show. And as I said from the beginning, this is not about what we want believe, or what we refuse to believe, its about what evidence shows. Otherwise we have been wasting our time and we can all just go home and believe whatever we want to believe.
ok ok!! I see, but I still dont think that anything will convince me this was necessary or right to do. Not marriage, getting away from the E&B image, getting back at fans, getting back at media and papz, is a reason. All it looks like is it was done for money, more money for them. I know no one asked me to get involved into looking into it, and wanting to prove that she didnt cheat, but I feel used and given a big slap in the face. I have never given a crap about celebs, and I have never seen the need to idolize them, I just seemed to like her because she didnt give a crap. And then just looked at the pics and knew they were not true. But if this was just some joke to them, well I just dont agree. My own fault I know, but wont be fooled again.
‘I’m sorry’ that you can’t accept the fact that there are proves that you dislike. If you are going to search it, as you sat and searched something like the whole thing above, then you will see that I am right. Just don’t judge me like you just did. I am a HUGE fan of Hemsworth and trust me I am able to know something more to him, like you are able to know something more about the whole cheating scandal. I never said if I agree or not with you, because in the end noone can knows. Anyway, i don’t like cyber bullying so, just take care
Dear Gig_H,
I think that what we are trying to prove here is that you can’t believe sources like hollywoodgossip.com. Twilighter has proven over and over that they are not reliable in any way, shape or form. If you check the date of the article you sited, it came out right after the pictures. Every gossip site out there was trying to make Kristen look guilty in any way they could. They made up sources and put words in the mouths of people that never made any kind of statement at all. Please go over to my other site, wertheplan.wordpress.com and read this article “How Stuff Works” , perhaps things will be more clear to you. Cyber bullying is an ugly accusation and will not be allowed on this site again. I am allowing it now only because you are new and you don’t have all of the facts that others here are aware of. Educate yourself about the validity or lack there of of the gossip sites. I believe that you will find that there are numerous articles out there that state that you can not believe what you read on gossip sites. Many of those articles are available at wertheplan.wordpress.com. Once you have read some articles, then believe as you will. But, those of us that have been working on this since July, KNOW that Chris Hemsworth and Charlize Theron did not ever make statements like the ones you are quoting from hollywoodgossip.com. Even if they thought it (which I don’t think they did), they have WAY more class than to say something to a site like hollywoodgossip.com. The name says it all “gossip”. They are not reliable sources and THAT we CAN prove.
Sue aka veulent_savoir, owner, JusticeforKristen.wordpress.com
veulentsavoir, I putted only one prove which seemed to be from that site randomly!..As I said whoever cares can search about what I said and check out through also details (like it happened here about the staged thing) and see. Take care you too
You are the one that needs to do some research and you also need to look very carefully at the dates. I challenge you to find ONE article that makes any statement like the ones you want to prove with a date that is with in the last month. I don’t think even the gossip sites have been brazen enough to post anything like that recently. Be careful. I wrote you, hoping that I could get you to be reasonable and to do a bit more research on your own. If you choose not to do that, that is your choice. But don’t come to my site and threaten me. That is not acceptable.
Its not a matter of liking or not liking what you say. We actually have a pretty broad range of opinions on this site and encourage that discussion as long as it is respectful and advances the state of the discussion. But claiming you can prove something when it turns out to be based on tabloid unnamed sources wastes everyone’s time and is part of the reason why this whole thing is in the state it is in. I’m sorry if you take offense, but we owe that to the thousands of people who visit this site and to the hundreds of people who review and make comments on it.
As a final note, I would take caution you in relying on unnamed sources in tabloid accounts. They can turn on celebrities faster than you know, even on someone like Chris Hemsworth whom you are a fan of. Fans of his brother are learning that the hard way as we speak.
To Gig_H – First, please provide a link to the Chris Hemsworth interview. You can’t, because it doesn’t exist. Now, I AM the one who researches these lying articles you so happily spread. As Twilighted57 said, gossip sites are just that – GOSSIP. I have seen and read so much evidence proving that these sites lie, and the tactics they use to get their story, that I’m amazed by the fact they are still in business. That they are even allowed to continue to operate. However, it is people such as yourself who allow them to continue, clicking on their sites, believing the lies they spew forth, and then spreading their falsehoods to anyone who will listen to you. We rely on EVIDENCE here. Not hearsay, not a gossip site paying someone to say “Oh, Charlize Theron said she doesn’t like Kristen”. THAT IS WHAT GOSSIP SITES DO. The gossip sites prey on people such as yourself for money. EVERY time you click on that site, their advertisers give them money. Since you believe all these lies, let me ask you this. Did ANY of those articles name their source? No? Because they can’t name their source – they don’t exist. It’s been proven time and time again. Go to this link http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/tabloid1.htm and carefully read it. If you do not, then that means you don’t WANT to see the truth, and that you, like many others, only want to spread the hatred and filth. As I said earlier, I have researched hundreds of pages of what the tabloids are capable of. If you would like to see MORE proof of what the tabloids are capable of, please ask. I’d be happy to share some truthful information with you. If you are interested in the truth, then read the link I’ve provided in this comment. If you’re not interested in the truth, then please stop wasting the people who DO care for the truth’s time. Your hatred is not welcome here.
We are all ready and willing to accept “facts”, but not what the tabloids say. If you have read TGP and the comments, you would have realised that is exactly what we are trying to do – find the facts.
None of us would be on this site if we believed every thing the tabloids said as they are in the habit of giving up to date “facts” concerning the celebrities, especially Kristen and Rob.
There are some people here who can even predict the “facts” a tabloid is going to publish tomorrow.
And where is the cyber bullying here?
I’m sorry t57, I always seem to put my foot in my mouth. I think most fans are upset about the MTV movie awards because Harry potter got a wonderful farewell tribute on the mmas the year the last movie came out and twilight isn’t getting that same respect. I can’t help how all of this made me feel.
Please don’t think you need to apologize to me. And please don’t take my comments as somehow insulting your feelings. That was not and is not my intention. If there is one universal truth in this whole thing, it is that many people have very strong feelings about this whole phenomenon we call Twilight.
But I really don’t think that Rob & Kristen felt unloved or unappreciated by the fandom. They didn’t need another round of MTV movie awards and all the rest of it to feel appreciated. Quite frankly, they both seemed to have tired of it and were ready to turn a new page in their lives. Which is one reason why they seemed so happy and energized at Cannes. Finally it wasn’t all about Twilight. I don’t don’t know them. I can’t know what is going on in their heads. But at least from my perspective, wouldn’t it be just a little hard to go back into the Twilight Zone for another whole year after you have an experience like that? Just saying.
No worries t57 I know you’re not being insulting. It’s we fans that wanted a MTV celebration. That’s where my anger is. I know rob and Kristen don’t want to look back and yes they and twilight meant something I can’t describe to their fans. thanks for letting me vent.
No proble. Feel free to vent any time.
Twilighted, I doubt they would even have to stage any of the follow-up tabloid stories, about arguments and dog custody and whatnot. The tabloids would have made those up in any case, and I assume most if not all were entirely made up.
Many of the stories which came up during their “disappearance” were challenged, or branded outright lies, by Gossip Cop. However, GC did make a number of statements about that time period which they insisted were true, including that there was a brief indiscretion, that Pattinson was very upset, and that the couple were, at the time, not speaking. I’m not going to claim Gossip Cop is infallible; but my understanding is that GC gets its information on Robert Pattinson directly from his agent, who is a friend of the site’s owner. Just wondering: is your theory that Pattinson’s agent is in on the staged scandal, and was passing along false information on his employer’s instructions; or that he was telling GC what he, himself believed to be true? Wouldn’t certain members of their staff, along with family and friends, have to be in on any staged or faked scandal as well?
Was this was set up, the tabloids would run with it without little need for further help. But I wouldn’t be surprised if they feed the machine from time to time. Just like the so-called August 20 photos of Kristen. I think those photos were simply dropped on the agency. But I agree, most of the tripe was entirely made up.
You are right that aside from doing major debunking GC did claim a limited number of thing as true. But as usual based on unnamed sources. As far as whether this info came from Rob’s agent who is purportedly Dan Bryant’s good friend,
1. That’s speculative, we don’t know where it came from.
2. Even if it did, as you indicate, we don’t know if its based in personal knowledge of the truth or whether it was designed to further a different agenda.
3. Or was based on only his belief as to what was happening.
What I think is true is that surprising few people had to be in on this to make it fly. And if anything is true about what has gone on for the last five years, Rob and Kristen are very good about keepoing things close to their chests.
It was Seymourblogger who insisted Rob’s agent was friends with Dan Bryant and was his source for R. Pattinson news. I wonder if she could provide a basis for that idea?
Dan Abrams. lol
Oops.
hey thats what Im here for!
Twilighter. I guess we could take this as a good sign that Popsugar has added 8 adds into the pictures and a total of 63 pictures. Maybe more people are questioning the pictures and popsugar sold adds, all about the money! But dont they see that maybe they are having more traffic at that site because people dont believe the story or pics and want to look for themselves? Please please let that be it, otherwise it is strange to put adds there. Right??
I saw that but I think you mean ads not adds as in additional pictures.
So settle down everyone, its still the same old 55 but because of advertising on 8 slides, it’s now the popsugar 63 and the numbering is even more scrambled than before in terms of the popsugar set. PopSugar once again trying to add clarity right? LOL, as I have said so often before, they are so predictable.
I saw that!! But after you click post there is no edit button!!! Fine laugh at me!! lol I was just hoping it was a good thing! Not to smart are they?
LOL, I know what you mean. Even HL has an edit button!
yes they do!!
I was wondering what you all think about the March 6, 2013 Podcast conversation with Jack Morrissey and Kevin Smith that is being talked about in the comments section of Gossip Cop? I won’t bother to restate what was said, but if you are curious you can listen to the exchange which begins about halfway into the Podcast. Jack Morrissey is apparently Bill Condon’s partner. Bill Condon, of course, is the director of BD1 and 2. Any comments?
Just my humble opinion but throughout, Jack has shown a propensity to ride Bill’s coattails on all things Twilight and seems to be the kind of person who wants to convince you he’s in the know and an insider on just about everything. You can take a look at his ICDB credentials and they are not impressive. Bill Condon has always been very protective of Rob and Kristen’s privacy but Jack has shown a past propensity to inflate his own importance in trying to talk about them. Of course some in the fandom have variously seized him as their new messiah because of what he had to say. I for one am much more skeptical.
I assume he’s basing his statements on things he’s been told directly by Bill Condon, so the validity of his statements depends completely on Condon’s position as a source. Any speculation of Morrissey’s own is less dependable, obviously. So the question is, how much authority does he have to make the statements he does?
He says several things.
1) “Stewart and Pattinson’s relationship was always real, not a PR stunt.”
If the relationship began during the filming of these movies, Condon would be in a pretty good position to know first-hand that they were really a couple. I think he can be considered reliable on this subject, and therefore so can Morrissey.
2) “They really did break up and reconcile.”
If he means the breakup and reconciliation was not a studio PR stunt, Condon may have some inside knowledge there. If he means they actually broke up for a time and finally made up, as described in the tabloids, that’s not quite so certain. It partly depends on whether Condon and/or Morrissey remained in friendly contact with the couple after filming was done, and whether Stewart or Pattinson would likely confide in them about personal matters, and I have no idea if that’s the case. Morrissey may be extrapolating, assuming that if the relationship was real, and the breakup wasn’t a PR stunt, the breakup and reconciliation must also be genuine.
3) “The events of last July were real.”
Again, does he mean they were not a PR stunt? Condon might have some insight into that, even months after filming ended.
Does he mean something inappropriate actually happened between Stewart and Sanders? How reliable this statement is depends on how he got the information. Did Stewart tell Morrissey or Condon it was real? That’s pretty close to 100% reliable. Did he observe the couple in the time immediately after the story’s release? Also pretty solid, although subjective. Is he once again assuming that if the whole thing was not studio PR, it must be completely true as reported? Not so much.
And what does he mean by “real?” Does he mean “it happened exactly as reported by Us Weekly” or does he mean “something unfortunate actually happened”? The two are usually clumped together, but they are very different. We can confidently say that at least some of the tabloid reports on the “scandal” and its aftermath were untrue, if only because they often contradict each other. You can’t simply say “everything is true” about this story. Yet Morrissey doesn’t stipulate that the essential event was real even if there were many bogus reports about it, or specify what happened, or otherwise distinguish between “insider” information and what he’s read in the tabloids. That makes the statement suspect in my mind.
4) “It broke up a marriage.”
Here, I think he’s talking off the top of his head, repeating what was claimed in the tabloids. Condon has, as far as I know, no insider information about Rupert Sanders, the state of his marriage, or the exact reasons behind his divorce. In the context of the interview, Morrissey seems to be using this statement to emphasize that the scandal was a serious thing, “after all, it ended a marriage” but was not reporting the cause of the divorce as though he had insider information, just as a bit of information that “everybody knows” because it’s been widely reported.
Are they that close to Stewart or Pattinson for them to confide in them?
That’s the central question, isn’t it? Knowing them during filming, which ended some time ago, wouldn’t give Condon or Morrissey any real insight into what they are doing right now. It’s possible they still see one another socially; but if not, having worked together before last July would make Condon reliable about their relationship until the end of filming, but not really after that.
On second thought, if the incident was a studio PR stunt they will be in the know. In that case their statements will have to be considered as an effort to further the stunt.
If the incident was real, (I don’t mean every thing as reported by tabs), would any one other than the family and may be their closest friends get a chance to see them when they were supposed to be in hiding?
If the incident was a punk, then they will probably act that part to the best of their ability in front of any one who is not connected with it.
Looks like the “Bermuda Triangle” The closer you try to get, more the chance of getting sucked in.
That’s such a good, if complicated, point! Condon would know if it was studio PR, but if he knew, he might not be free to reveal the fact.
If it was all staged for any reason, it’s unlikely he would have been taken into Stewart’s confidence. They would act the part. Many comparative “insiders” might well have believed the couple were split up, if they left their home separately (as reported) and didn’t turn up again for some time. So even a genuine “insider source” telling what he has observed would only unwittingly support the staged situation.
You’re right, it’s the Bermuda Triangle in here.
You are right but I think it can be safe to say that the relationship did not start with the filming of BD, but a long time before this. And I think it was very very wrong to have said a damn thing about this topic as he knew very well he was using is relationship to Bill and because of this anyone who heard this (without a brain) will believe, because he must know he is Bill’s SO. I dont know him but I dont want to, I think he is just as scuzzy as the tabloid writers, he is a vocal tabloid. He should have kept his mouth shut and if I was Bill I would be so so angry at him and his unprofessional and unethical ways. jmho tho
Around the time that BD1 was released, Jack Morrissey said himself that he had never met Rob or Kristen so I hardly think that he has any direct knowledge of anything in their private lives. I agree that he is just trying to inflate his own importance. I can’t say I was too impressed when I met him in November, seems like a slippery one he does.
Twilighter, you know that I really admire your work & what you did so far, personally I think R&K had no choice- photoshopped pics were shown to them when they were ready & they had no other choice, they had to cooperate but of course this may not be whats really happened. My main question now is what are you planning to do with all that info, I mean are you looking for a reporter or publisher?Time goes by.. We have plenty of evidences but have nothing do with it at the moment, can I help somehow?
We’ll talk more about this “forced” notion in a new scenario in Part 13, Summit Entertainment As Darth Vader. So hold that thought.
We are exploring a more broad-based strategy for distribution. Any suggestions you have would be welcomed, especially if you have contacts in the news media.
Do you know how much I would love for summit/lionsgate to be behind this and not rob and Kristien.
When do you think it will be time to take it to the next stage? I think people just won’t let the scandal die & that’s annoying … I think I can help with that but wouldn’t like to say more in those comments, it would be great if I can email you, Sue has my e-mail
I’ll ask her to forward your email.
Hi t57, been reading the new comments and you may want to get to part 13 sooner rather than later. If rob and Kristen did stage this it doesn’t mean they’re bad people or hate their fans. they’re just desperate for a life and career after twilight with no paps or stalkers. I wish more people could understand this. They need their privacy back even if it means making people hate them. God speed t57
well put and 13 is coming
Hi t57, I just came across some.comments I missed. The first comment I ever made about the scandal was that they staged it to get married. That could be what they were doing when they disappeared. a wedding was the last thing anyone was looking. When I said I understand why they would stage this marriage was always part of my hypothesis. I really don’t think they did the right thing no matter how good the intention.
Hi again t57, just.saw you’re comment to my latest.rant. Teenage girls unfortunately do have a.very hard time separating fiction from reality. I’m a mom and I see this situation from a mom’s point of view. That I think is my downfall. We have to look out for all that look up to us. I think we both agree on the why but must agree to.disagree on How fans.feel about all of this. It’s not easy being a.teenage girl. I’m very.glad I’m pushing 40 right now for once:-)
Dawn, why do you think that you know how all the fans feel. I am a fan and I do not feel hurt or betrayed. You keep saying that the fans hate or are hurt over this. You are the fan that is hurt for whatever reason. I don;t want to sound mean but you need to seperate fantasy from reality.
I have no problem separating fantasy from reality. I’m a mom with a psychology background. I worry too much about younger fans because of what I’ve seen on my own twitter page. if rob and Kristen did stage this then yes it bothers me a little. Just my opinion.
You have always been honest about that and I hope you have not taken offense.
Dawn, I’m very sympathetic to your attitude, especially as regards younger fans. All the same, let’s say, for the sake of argument, that Kristen Stewart does take seriously the fact that girls look up to her. She might feel that allowing them to continue to blur reality and fantasy is not the most responsible way for a role model to behave. If she is, in fact, planning to throw a pie in the face of celebrity culture, I can imagine her thinking it’s for the benefit of her young fans, as well as herself. It’s not kind to let idealistic girls continue to be lied to and misled about their idols, even if it’s easier on them in the short term. Someone who fights back against an unfair system is a much more exciting, and valuable, role model, anyway.
For the record, if either of my kids ever had to go through what rob and Kristen have gone through over the past 5 years, I’d beg them to leave Hollywood every chance I could. apparently I’ve been told I live in a fantasy world so I’m going to pick up my fantasy kids, make fantasy dinner, do fantasy homework, give them fantasy baths and go to bed with my fantasy husband. Just jokes, I’m done for a while. Have a good one all:-)
dawn,
i would like to apologize for my comment. i now understand that it is the young fans that you know that are having a hard time. i over reacted to your last few comments. i have gone back through many of your old comments and you do bring good input to this blog. please continue to do so.
Hey dawn, Please don’t run away! You have a backgorund in psychology, you should know more about the intricacies of human behavior and as such you should be consoling us.
Didn’t you read Badger’s comment?
Get your kids to take special note of the last sentence in her comment.
While we are talking about the unfairness of the act committed by Stewart, we should also spare a moment to ponder on the reasons which made her do this.
If it was staged, then there will be a real good reason for it.
While we are busy talking about the pain she caused her fans, we are conveniently forgetting about the turmoil she is in right now. We are also not considering the fact that she too has a right to some privacy in her personal life. Wouldn’t you agree that she is also entitled to live her life like any other 22 year old?
If it was real, I have only one thing to say, the one thing I learnt from my experience. The past and present behavior of a person is no pointer to what that person may or may not do under certain circumstances in the future.
Correct me if I am wrong.
Wasn’t Kristen referring to the red carpet and interview appearences? She was saying some thing like she could or would never look perfect on such occasions or else people on the red carpet may think she is faking. I do not believe she was talking about her personal life then. Even if she was, we still have to admit she is only human and likely to commit mistakes like any other human.
Please come back and give me a reply.
not to butt in but I think K has said many many times in different circumstances that she does not like fake
I only said I was done for a while not for good. I work full time and have 2 small sons. Hubby and I are busy getting ready for Easter bunny’s arrival right now. Just don’t have time to come here very much right now. Bottom line, I think rob and Kristen staged the scandal with the help of Rupert and liberty who’s marriage was already on the rocks, so they could get married in absolute privacy and also to help them get out from under twilight’s enormous shadow. I completely understand why they would have done this. I just don’t think it was a good decision. They’re both sweet, shy young adults who’s crippling fame drove them to do something desperate. It’s sad what we fans and media have put them through. It sucks that it came to them staging this scandal.
This is probably way off in left field so please forgive me.
I have been mulling this over since this unfortunate fiasco came to light. Could there be any way that Summit be part of this “said” affair? I just can’t shake this. It isn’t based on anything. Just a hunch. Or maybe it has been questioned and I have missed that theory with all of them out there.
That possibility has been discussed a lot. It comes up in the comments here, if you look through them.
That version is a possibility even though Twilighter won’t agree with some of us 🙂
Any thing is so by all means put it on the table. But get ready to defend it because I am going to take a big swat at it in Pt. 13. 🙂
Okay, I’m going to throw a few cents in here. I haven’t read all of the Grand Punk, but have been stirring a theory for awhile. As you’ll be able to tell, this idea still needs lots of work. With the lighting, the position of the cameras, Rupert looking at the camera, etc., it’s obvious Kristen and Rupert knew the pix were being taken, but something keeps coming back to bother me. The picture of Kristen getting out of her car with the rolled up paper. What if that WAS a script, of SWATH 2? What if Rupert talked her into meeting him to go over that script, and do a few “practice scenes”? (No idea what they’re called, obviously.) Kristen meets him, gives him a hug, as she does everyone she sees, they meet several times to “practice” a few scenes, hence the different nail polish and different colored bra straps, with a cameraman and lighting tech. What if Rupert or the cameraman, or someone else who was there, decided to make some money off either of them, or even Summit, with some sort of blackmail? Both Kristen AND Rob had movies coming out very soon. Would Rob and Kristen say no way we’re agreeing to these demands, go ahead and release them? Could Summit then demand some sort of statement from Kristen because of BD2’s release being so close to that time? I do think Rob and Kristen were together the entire time they were “missing”, and wouldn’t be surprised at all to find out they got married during this time. As you can see, this is still in the idea stage, and not thought out completely at all, so am I completely off base here? Could this, or something like this, be possible? If this has already been tossed out and I missed it, I apologize, but I don’t remember reading this theory anywhere. Help please?
I don’t know about theories, but I can tell you that this entire setup was poorly done. The pictures are fake, the photos are all wrong. I still say that they wanted to hurt Kristen and Robert or blackmail them. I feel that this is not from Kristen’s pass, but from someone who had enough money and destroy her because of something that happened in the pass.